NPIP and Fermenting Feed
They don’t really go together but both are hot topics! NPIP is necessary for shows and selling out of state. Fermenting Feed can be dangerous if done wrong. Get the low down on the podcast.
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Jennifer: 0:01
Welcome poultry enthusiasts to another exciting episode of the Poultry Nerds Podcast.
Carey: 0:08
Whether you're raising backyard chickens, diving deep into the science of avian health, are just obsessed with all things feathered and eggs. You're in the right place. I'm Carey.
Jennifer: 0:21
And I'm Jennifer, your host. And today we have got an episode packed with everything you need to know about the NPIP program and fermenting feed.
Carey: 0:33
From expert tips, fascinating facts, We're here to help you become the ultimate poultry pro. It's time to get nerdy.
0:42
Mhm.
Carey: 0:52
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Jennifer: 1:53
Well, Carey, we're going to talk about NPIP today.
Carey: 1:57
Let me tell you, I have my tin foil hat on. Now,
Jennifer: 2:01
we're, look, we talked about this. We're not going to go down rabbit holes. We're just going to give the information that they need.
Carey: 2:10
Okay, we say we're not. We'll see what happens. I mean, we got 20, 30 minutes to go.
Jennifer: 2:17
No, no, I'm going to release you on the fermenting feed rabbit hole, but we're just going to stay true to the NPIP program information.
Carey: 2:28
I'll do my best.
Jennifer: 2:30
Okay, so for people who don't know, this is the National Poultry Improvement Program. It is run by the federal government. Well, okay, the federal government owns it, but the state ag departments run it independently. And each state runs it differently. So, it's not consistent. It's not consistent across the states. You're gonna make me laugh, so quit. So, if you live, well, okay, I'm in Tennessee, so I'll tell you about Tennessee. So they come and they do a sampling of your birds. It has to be at least 30 birds. If you have less than 30, then they just test them all. They don't care about your hygiene, where you keep your feed there's nothing else. They just test your birds and I think it's went up this year. So it's 75 for the year. But like Craig in Oklahoma, they are now inspecting how you keep your feed and they have to keep it in I don't know if he was specific, if it was a metal drum or just drums in general, but they're inspecting the premises and feed storage and all of that stuff up there. And yes, they want to
Carey: 3:56
know how I keep my feet.
Jennifer: 3:58
Yes.
Carey: 3:59
I'm out today.
Jennifer: 4:01
He, he me and him had a conversation about it and I was just as shocked as you were. Michigan, one of my besties lives in Michigan and those are all independent testers up there. And they set their own prices and it's quite pricey for the serum that they use to test it is quite pricey.
Carey: 4:24
So if I live in Oklahoma.
Jennifer: 4:28
A state,
Carey: 4:29
a state where I can test my own flock.
Jennifer: 4:32
Yeah.
Carey: 4:33
I've got to answer questions about where I store my feed and what it looks like.
Jennifer: 4:38
Yeah.
Carey: 4:40
All right. Got it.
Jennifer: 4:42
So, so listen, take that one
Carey: 4:43
off coach.
Jennifer: 4:44
No rabbit holes today. So how much is it in Alabama?
Carey: 4:49
So it just recently, it went up this past year and I want to say it's like 60 or 70 bucks which was a significant increase because the year before I think it was like 20.
Jennifer: 5:04
And there's several states that are free. I think it's free in Florida.
Carey: 5:08
From, well, okay, so NPIP was free. A. I. is what they charge extra for, and that was to cover lab cost because the the,
Jennifer: 5:18
the
Carey: 5:19
serum to check for
Jennifer: 5:23
pallorum,
Carey: 5:24
you know, they just stab the bird up under the wing and dip it down in the serum that that's all they're doing. It's free. If you want the ai, you have to pay the extra few bucks for the, the, I guess the lab time and the people that wear the white coats and the tinfoil hats to test it out to make sure they don't have ai.
Jennifer: 5:47
So a lady in California contacted me on my opinion on NPIP. And I asked you said,
Carey: 5:54
we can do that.
Jennifer: 5:56
I'm just telling you about a conversation we had. And anyway, she said it was going to cost her like 2000 dollars. And I told her, yeah, I said, do not do it. It's not worth it. So, we kind of skipped over why you would want to do and kind of jump straight to the cost. So, if you're still interested after hearing the cost, then. I'll give you the rest of the information on the whys. So the reason why I first started with the program was because I go to the shows, and the shows require you to be NPIP. Okay. So I have to carry my paperwork with me. It has to be in date crossing state lines with the birds typically. And then I have to give the certificates at the shows. If you are not in PIP, a lot of shows will do the testing onsite once your birds are already in the show. Yeah,
Carey: 6:57
I was going to say, I see, I see like all at the edge of the parking lot before you make it to the area that has some tables set up and you can do your NPIP there. And I think usually they charge like 10 bucks.
Jennifer: 7:14
And so that's what first got me started on doing NPIP. But then I got into shipping and so to legally ship. Eggs and birds across state lines, you have to be NPIP. Now, this does not help you, well, okay, it does not allow you to ship out of the country. I think, ship into Canada, you have to be NPIP is like the first step, but there's a whole lot more steps. And
Carey: 7:45
I think to get, to export to another country. That's like 30 days at a time.
Jennifer: 7:52
It's a process.
Carey: 7:53
That's a whole nother different long process.
Jennifer: 7:56
I have been asked to ship out of the country. Had the people send me the requirements and I said, well, I'll do it. In some instances I would do it, but it's going to cost you for me to do it. Some of them I just can't because it's, it's so in depth with the USDA that there's not really any way I can do it. I have to, there's a whole lot of requirements that we're just not going to talk about here. So, let's talk back to the NPIP. So, once you get tested, And you will pass because I don't think they found Palorum in like, since the 80s.
Carey: 8:36
I think that I, I don't remember like 86, I think, but don't quote me on that, but I do believe it was the 80s most recently.
Jennifer: 8:44
Yeah. And so you'll pass and then assuming that you live in a state like, you know, Alabama or Tennessee, where they don't look at your hygiene. Then you're done. You get a piece of paper in the mail. Now if you live in one of the other states where they want to dig around in your barn and see how clean you are, you're just gonna have to call and talk to your state ag department and find out exactly what they're gonna be looking at. Because I don't have time to look at 50 different requirements
Carey: 9:18
to be honest, like, I would really recommend that anyway, because, you know, we're, we're telling you about our particular states, but, you know, right now, at the date of this recording, it's the beginning of January. And a lot of states had new regulations go into effect and there's a lot of Facebook groups out there that I love that talk about quail and other poultry. But don't, I don't recommend you go in those and ask because the person that you find that may give you the answer, they're going to tell you what they did for their state most recently. And if a new law went into effect this month, they may not know. So, start at your state Department of Agriculture's website, or you can simply Google NPIP plus your state. And it's going to take you to your state requirements because they do change and they are different from state to state. So, we encourage you to do that and get it straight from USDA.
Jennifer: 10:28
Some reasons why you would want to be would be you show you ship eggs across state lines. If you're just selling in your state, you do not need it. That would really be the only two reasons why you would want it, right? I can't think of anything else.
Carey: 10:47
Well, to add to the selling in your state part, I will say that in some of the more bougie areas, and again, this is for my state, some of the municipalities that have farmer's markets will only allow you to sell like actual birds or eggs if you have your NPIP card, like you, you have to show them. And then they'll be
Jennifer: 11:15
In the state?
Carey: 11:16
Yeah, like, you know, I'm I live right outside of Birmingham in Hoover, which is another municipality. There is, and this is funny because at this particular thing that they have one weekend a month, you can buy raw milk there, you can buy a whole lot of stuff that can go down a whole lot of rabbit holes, but you can't sell. Any eating eggs, hatching eggs, any kind of eggs for animal consumption only, whatever, unless you have your NPIP card. But you can sell raw milk for animal use only, or animal consumption only, and they don't ask you for anything on that. I thought that was really weird and I don't, I don't sell anything at that farmer's market.
Jennifer: 12:12
Okay, so if we haven't deterred you with the cost or the paperwork and you still want to ship and you get your NPIP, so you're going to contact your state ag department. Now, you get, you get through all those hoops, which, depending on your state, is going to be how hard those hoops are. Then, you decide to ship. You're going to go into the NPIP website, and you will be issued a login from your state. Mm hmm. And you will go in there, and you have to fill out a form, and it says, it says who you are, where they're going, what they are, when you're shipping them. And it also asks you what they're going to do with them, which I always just put for their personal use because I never ask anybody. But, and then you file that. You hit enter or submit. Submit. I guess it is submit. And then it'll come back if they approve it or not. And I've had them take a minute, and I've had them take a day. And then on top of that, you're also going to find another tab with other state import requirements. I would encourage you to read through that list, and fill out what states you're going to ship to use paperwork that they ask you to fill out.
Carey: 13:38
Yeah, because if you do it at that point, then the system will go ahead and send your information and your latest test results and all that crap to that state, so they can have it. And then when you submit to send something to that state, You get a quicker response.
Jennifer: 14:05
Yep. And this is for eggs and birds. And the rules will change. They're very fluid with the AI situation.
Carey: 14:18
Yeah. Because there's a lot going on with AI right now. And some states have like a 30 day rule and all kinds of stuff. So. Make sure you check into it.
Jennifer: 14:31
Okay. And as a bonus, before I turn him loose on his rabbit hole of fermenting feed, that if you are NPIP and you have a number, you can be found on the NPIP database, which is public information. And so you can prove to people that you're not a scammer, or you can do the opposite. If you're a buyer, you can look and see if. They are legit. It's a good, it's a good point to rule people out from being scammers, but it's not the end all be all.
Carey: 15:10
True.
Jennifer: 15:10
Yeah,
Carey: 15:11
I saw a post where somebody was trying to they're like, I wonder, does this person look like a scammer and I'm like, well, first of all, if you got a post in another group, anonymously and ask that question, they probably are, but I just replied. I said, well, if they're a legit breeder. Have them take their NPIP cards, stick it over their driver's license, hold it by their face, and send you a selfie. And if they won't do that, then I wouldn't, I wouldn't send them 250 for a dozen eggs.
Jennifer: 15:48
Okay, so I think that's the highlights of NPIP. If you have other questions, contact your State Ag Department. And go from there. Yes, and there's no bees going to come kill all your birds just because you contacted them. So that rumor going around Facebook is not true. So just contact them. They'll give you the information. All right, fermented feed. So I get to start this because I'm going to say something I almost never say. I don't know anything about fermented feed. I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole if it were up to me, but For my own reasons, but I don't know anything about it. I know fermenting People food is supposed to be good for your gut, but I mean there's a science behind it. So why is fermenting feed Such a, I don't know, is it clickbait on social media?
Carey: 16:49
See, I don't know, because people, you have both sides. There's some people that absolutely swear by it. And there's some people that will tell you you're going to hell and all your chickens are going to die. And and I'm over here, like. Let me look and see how well their tin cap is adjusted. Ferment and poultry feed has gotten to be really popular because it does have some potential benefits. Like, I mean, it does help improve digestibility, it enhances gut health, better feed conversion ratios, especially if you're feeding a lower quality feed. It helps you. Expand it and get the most out of it. You'll reduce food waste. It's a natural enrichment. You're getting more moisture inside of the bird. All that stuff is the great part about it.
Jennifer: 17:52
Can I ask you a question right there?
Carey: 17:53
Please.
Jennifer: 17:54
So, when you say getting more moisture into the bird, what I envision is you're filling up the bird on water and not the nutrients that it needs. True or false?
Carey: 18:07
They don't want you to think about that.
Jennifer: 18:09
Okay, what I do, because I'm a nerd, so, so you're filling them up on water, right?
Carey: 18:17
Well, that is why they say that your chickens eat less. Well, I mean, no crap. They're filling up on water and you're making their food swell up, you know? So it's kind of like eating rice. Okay. Go to the Chinese restaurant, eat some rice. You're really full. 45 minutes later, you're starving. Kind of the same principle.
Jennifer: 18:45
I can see that.
Carey: 18:46
The cons, some of the more popular cons in fermenting feed is freaking time consumable. Like, it takes a lot of time to do it and, and it's not just something where dump some crap in a bucket, dump some water in it, come back, boom, you're good. Because With fermenting feed, which this is some of the other cons, is you run a risk of improper fermentation. If it's not done just right and timed correctly, the feed will spoil, mold will grow very quickly, especially if you're in the south where it's humid. Because the humidity fights against you and you will have more harmful bacteria that can grow really quick. You know, in the South, we call it the dog days of summers, the hottest days where if you think about going outside, you sweat because the humidity is so high and that just breeds infection. It's kind of the same thing when you're fermenting your feed. When you're fermenting feed, you also have storage challenges because it really needs to be properly kept to prevent spoilage, including regulating the temperature. Should I seal it up? Should I not seal it up? Well, you know, you want to seal it to keep stuff out of it. But if you seal it and it's fermenting and it off gasses, you're going to pop the lid off, which lets whatever is in the area get into it, whether it be rats and you know, whatever. And here's the, the, the simple thing is it's not necessary with a high quality feed. And if you're raising poultry, whether it's, you know, your, your silkies, your crabs, your Rhode Island reds, your beefy landers, or your bellifelders. or your Jersey Giants or your Cochins or whatever. You're raising them because you like them. And if you think about it for a minute, like you like your kids, you want to feed them something good. Well, if you're feeding a high quality feed, you don't need to, you don't need to spend the extra time of fermentation. That's typically done for people that want to save money on feed. But if you don't do it and manage it properly, You could actually give the bird a toxic level of some kind of mold or other harmful bacteria and kill it.
Jennifer: 21:49
Alright, so I know just enough to be dangerous on this, and that's really just what I see on social media. So I've seen that you can't ferment feed if it has animal byproducts in it. True or false?
Carey: 22:02
I've seen that a lot. And no, to be able to ferment it, you have to have like real natural whole grains that can't be processed or anything like that.
Jennifer: 22:15
I mean, you can't go just buy the 12 bag from the co op and dump it with some water. That won't make it good food.
Carey: 22:25
No, that would probably actually spoil or ruin faster because I
Jennifer: 22:31
wish y'all could have seen his eyebrows look at me like I was crazy.
Carey: 22:35
Well, what's crazy, what's crazy is I have a collection of feed tags and I was actually looking through it and I saw one of those 14 bags from the co op and I was just like, Oh God, I can't because somebody was like, how much supplement would I need to put with this to make this an adequate fee? And I'm looking at it and it's like filler, this byproduct, that byproduct, this. And I'm, I just asked him, I said, what does it smell like when you open the bag? And I said, and they said, they're literally their text response. Well, it kind of smells like garbage and like. I'm sorry, and I'll admit it, and if the person is still listening to the show because they're still a fan, I'm really sorry it just popped out when I said, because that's what it is, you're feeding your chickens garbage and no, you, you can't add water to garbage and make it grow and produce something great. If that's the case, then all of our chicken runs and all of our barns, every time it rained, they would smell amazing instead of atrocious.
Jennifer: 23:51
Okay. So I saw a tick talk today and she put, and I do not know what kind of feed she put in the bucket. And then she dumped a whole bunch of brewer's yeast in there, and then some water, and then put a paint bucket lid on top of it.
Carey: 24:07
Mm hmm.
Jennifer: 24:08
What's the brewer's yeast for?
Carey: 24:11
To have something in there to ferment, because she's using a feed that's got processed grain byproducts. And it looks
Jennifer: 24:20
like crumble
Carey: 24:21
and she needs it to ferment.
Jennifer: 24:24
Okay. So if you decided to ferment you, I'm hearing you say that it has to be whole grains
Carey: 24:32
needs to be whole grains and you, you need to be scientific with it if it's properly managed and done. Right? It can be very beneficial. The downside is most people do it, don't do it correctly, and don't, you know, we don't like to follow instructions, we don't like to read them, we just like to look at pictures, and the pictures we see are people dumping water in buckets and we don't pay attention to the other stuff. If it's not properly managed, it could be toxic.
Jennifer: 25:10
So give us a short version of proper management, just stirring it, swishing it once a day or something.
Carey: 25:18
You're supposed to do that, do that, put the lid back on it, and like, however long it takes to process in your climate, two to three days. You don't, you don't want to try to get too much out of it. You just wait till it starts to ferment, and then you need to dump it out and feed it to your birds. You don't, don't try to overdo it because it's not going to get better. Once it crosses that peak, it goes downhill and that's where the bacteria and stuff grow.
Jennifer: 25:49
So what about like foam, like when you do a sourdough starter, you can, it bubbles up and then you get like a, they call it a hooch on top of it. So is ferment and feed the same thing? Why are you laughing at me?
Carey: 26:05
So when I first started looking at this and there's, there's actually an article posted on one of my social media accounts about fermenting feed and the whole time. This is there. I'm like, and this is, this is like making homemade wine. Cause if you think about it, I mean, that's the process. And with homemade wine, if you do it too long, it's toxic. And if you don't do it right, it can be toxic. But if you do it right, it could be quality.
Jennifer: 26:43
Okay, so let's just kind of, since I'm going to play the, the ignorant person here, because I really don't know anything about it this would be something for somebody with just a handful of birds. Somebody like me, who crosses into the thousands, this is an unattainable process.
Carey: 27:05
Alright, so here's what you do. You got to choose the right feed. So it's got to be a non pelleted or crumble for best results. Pelleted feed can break down inconsistently during fermentation, and that gives you a whole crap load of variables. Mix that with a ratio, mix that with water. One part feed, two parts water, stir it up.
Jennifer: 27:32
Where are you going to get this non processed food?
Carey: 27:37
That place where you could get that quality feed. They'll typically have the raw grain ingredients. So you're covered up
Jennifer: 27:46
with homemade feed?
Carey: 27:49
I mean typically people that ferment it are mixing a bunch of stuff together to kind of homemade their own concoction because there again they don't, not everybody wants to spend 25, 30 dollars on a bag of feed because not everybody understands the the nutritional science behind it and they don't understand the labor saving part or they don't value time. Money coefficient, and they don't understand that when you feed a bird a higher quality feed, they actually consume less because they're eating less fillers and all that other stuff. That's like for a whole different show. They don't understand that stuff. And yeah, you do it for, like, 2448 hours. You've got to keep it between 65 and 75 degrees even so there again, you got to have it in a climate controlled area. And, you know, I don't know about most of us folks, but if I tried to do this in my living room where it is climate controlled, because my barn is, one of my barns is, but the rest of them aren't my wife's not going to be happy with the smell that comes off in that 24 to 48 hours. So I don't do it. You know, if you've got a small flock, it can enhance your gut health. that kind of stuff. But even with a small flaw, it takes a lot of time. It takes a lot of time. There's a lot to it. And it's just,
Jennifer: 29:27
could you get the same benefits from just giving them a dollop of yogurt?
Carey: 29:32
Yep.
Jennifer: 29:34
I just thought of that. Well,
Carey: 29:38
I mean, you know, we've talked about chicks and raising chicks and giving them like. Raw unfiltered yogurt or raw milk or buttermilk, you know, on day three and day seven, a couple of the day, you know, we talk about all that. And that's why, because it builds that gut health up to help prevent them from getting other diseases and stuff like that. You know, if, if a bird has a strong gut health. They're not going to get coccidiosis. I mean, they, they can, if your place is absolutely atrocious, but it significantly reduces the chance, but this will help, you know, build gut health and things like that.
Jennifer: 30:26
Okay, so if you saw dumping some feed and some water in a bucket. And lowering your feed costs on Tik Tok, then hopefully we have talked you out of it because my biggest fear and why I have never even tried it, and this is actually the first conversation I've ever actually had about it is I was always afraid it would mold.
Carey: 30:51
Yeah, and like, to me, that that's the biggest thing, because my brain could wander down another rabbit hole and I totally forget what's in this bucket. That I should have fed my chickens yesterday, and I let it get just a little too much, and I don't know, you know, it smells bad, but I don't notice that it's moldy, and I feed it to my chickens, and my chickens get sick. I would, me personally, I would feel bad about that.
Jennifer: 31:23
So, me and you are all about being practical. And you know, just doing, we're not bougie, we're practical, but we like nice stuff. Yeah. Okay, we can do, we can say it like that, right? Yeah. So, you know, we, if I had to give a piece of advice as far as feed is concerned, and this is after I actually ran the feed experiment, is you get what you pay for, and the better the feed, the less they eat. Yep. So, buy the better feed, and you will actually save money because chances are that cheaper feed that you're buying is actually more per pound, which is, I ran into that too, the Purina bag that I bought was only a 40 pound bag. 40 pound bag and it was more expensive. So they don't, they
Carey: 32:18
don't want you to think about that. They want you to think, Oh, that's the right thing. And it's a 50 pound bag, like the rest of them.
Jennifer: 32:26
So pay attention to that kind of stuff and just try a bag of more quality feed, you don't have to have it custom custom. You have to pay attention to custom because I see, I see a lot of people, they'll message me, and I know they message him, they get it from the Amish, or they get it from the Mennonites, or they get it from Billy Bob on the west side of the mountain or something. And he said it was good for quail, or he said it was good for layer hens. And you tell them to send you the feed tag and it says corn and soy and distiller grains. That's usually what's in it, distiller grains. And so that's, that's fine if your birds are free ranging. But if you're providing a hundred percent of their nutrition, then just buy the good stuff. You'll spend less money in the long run.
Carey: 33:26
So like using the data off of your feed experiment and a couple of others that I've seen. If a, if a feed costs 20 percent more, but it meets the nutritional needs of the bird in the long run, it will actually cost you 15 percent less. Because when a bird goes from, everybody knows that the average chicken eats four ounces a day. Average chicken, everybody says, four ounces per bird per day. Like, they say it like robots.
Jennifer: 34:05
Huh.
Carey: 34:06
I feed mine two and a half to two and three quarters ounces.
Jennifer: 34:11
Even the reds?
Carey: 34:12
Even the reds.
Jennifer: 34:14
Mm.
Carey: 34:16
And that was, And the advice of Rip, because when I was feeding them, when I first started feeding them after a while, they started feeling fat and the hens, I mean, standard birds don't lay worth a crap anyway, but they started laying even less. And I said something to him about it. First thing he said was, what do they feel like? I don't know. I didn't pick them up a couple of weeks. He said, go pick them up. and we talked about it and that's what he said. You're feeding them too much. Your birds have reached their potential and it's time to put them on a diet. And so I cut back to about two and three quarters of an ounce is what I found is that sweet spot that helps him maintain that way this within standard and I actually get a decent amount of eggs and I'm getting three, four eggs a week out of them, even like when it snowed last week, I got eggs.
Jennifer: 35:26
Okay. So just so everybody knows, yes, I listened to everything he says. No, I don't do a hundred percent of what he says. So my grow outs get the perpetually.
Carey: 35:39
Now my girl, the girl outs is different. Look, I don't limit the feed on anything until they start laying eggs.
Jennifer: 35:47
Oh, okay. All right, good.
Carey: 35:49
So No, and it's, I mean, that's, that's how you wind up with full grown birds in a couple months where everybody else gets it in six months.
Jennifer: 36:00
So, I do have some prepackaged food. I do have Gary send me some custom feed for some of the birds. But I'm like, I'm like the more middle ground, I guess, because I just am feeding so much. I mean, just for purposes of this conversation, I think I go through close to 150, 200 pounds a day. And I was
Carey: 36:27
going to say, I think last time I was up there and we had that conversation, you were not depending on. I forget what the variable was that you said you were 150, 200 pounds a day, which I feed 100 pounds a day.
Jennifer: 36:42
Yeah. So come June, July, somewhere in there. Hey,
Carey: 36:47
let's don't talk about that.
Jennifer: 36:49
I'll talk. My
Carey: 36:49
wife listens.
Jennifer: 36:53
So once those turkeys start growing out, I'll hit 300 pounds. I mean, they'll, the turkeys alone were, were eating almost 50 pounds. I mean, turkeys,
Carey: 37:03
turkeys are like
Jennifer: 37:04
pigs.
Carey: 37:06
Yeah. So it
Jennifer: 37:09
did carry some turkeys. He did not know
Carey: 37:12
a very, very inquisitive pig. Yeah. I like, I really, I like that. That little, it's almost like a chirping sound that they make when they're like wanting to know what's going on. That's pretty, I like that sound. It's neat.
Jennifer: 37:32
We've totally gotten off topic again, but I have to finish this thought. So y'all know that I have turkeys and I raised the red bourbons and I have a bearded hen and she's probably pushing five years old at this point. And I have been trying like the Dickens to get that bearded hand bred into. Her offspring. Well, just since we have been recording, I want you to know that somebody who bought a hen off of me just texted me and she said the hen has a beard. So, yay! I finally accomplished it. And I don't even own the bird anymore.
Carey: 38:14
But still, I mean, to know that that trait's hanging around and breeding forward like he wanted to. You know, that's, that's pretty good.
Jennifer: 38:23
Yep. So hopefully we have given y'all the information you need to make a decision for yourselves. If NPIP is is good for you. It's not a fit for everybody. And fermenting feed. I still will never do it because I am not going to risk feeding my birds moldy feed. It's not worth the risk to me and so I've never delved down the rabbit hole because that was just enough information for me. To stop and decide for myself, I wasn't going to do it. If you guys decide to do it, please do some research and don't just listen to somebody on TikTok.
Carey: 39:12
I mean, I know we're on a podcast, but we're at least giving references. And with anything that we talk about or with anything you see on TikTok, regardless of what it is, I strongly encourage you to do your homework.
Jennifer: 39:26
Mm hmm. Please. I mean, that knowledge is power and, and just, I don't know, can they hear the dog barking in the background? I don't know if it fades it out. So somebody asked me the other day, why should they listen to us? Cause we're just influencers or trying to make a buck or whatever. And did we try to sell anybody anything during this podcast? We actually tried to talk people out of stuff. So just keep in mind where you're getting the information from and do your homework.
Carey: 40:03
All
Jennifer: 40:05
right. Well, that's a wrap today. poultry nerds. Thanks for tuning in and geeking out with us on all things poultry. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe, rate, and leave a review wherever you listen to your podcasts.
Carey: 40:23
Also, don't forget to follow us on social media. Visit our website for more poultry tips, recordings, and upcoming episodes. Until next time, keep those chickens happy, healthy, and stay nerdy.
40:40
Yeah. Okay. Bye.
